.22 vs .25
- Thread starter spyde82
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In many ways yes I think it would this is a 28.5 grains .22cal and the other chart is 29.5 grain .25 cal
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the energy will be same directly when the pellets leave the barrel, but other then that it will be all different depending on speed, BC, barrel and so on.
even if they weigh same and shoot same speed, they will behave different each yard traveling down range, except if the BC is same at that given speed and barrel, then they will probably? be in same energy-state over distance, at least within pellet/Slug normal shooting distances.
even if they weigh same and shoot same speed, they will behave different each yard traveling down range, except if the BC is same at that given speed and barrel, then they will probably? be in same energy-state over distance, at least within pellet/Slug normal shooting distances.
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Are you asking to compare the .25 JSB King to the .22 JSB RD Monster? If so they are very similar in accuracy, but the .22 seriously out performs the .25 in most areas. It would be more apples to apples to compare the .25 King to the .22 JSB Exact Heavy, since they have identical BCs.
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In general, where most other variables are held reasonably constant:
1. The BC of the smaller caliber (.22) will be higher, making it less susceptible to wind drift and capable of retaining more energy at a greater distance.
2. The smaller caliber (.22) will require more air and/or a longer barrel to get it to the same speed (less area on which to push).
3. The smaller caliber (.22) will penetrate deeper and is more likely to result in a pass-through on game or pests. Conversely, the larger caliber (.25) will produce a larger wound channel and will dissipate a larger portion of its energy, and is less likely to pass through.
1. The BC of the smaller caliber (.22) will be higher, making it less susceptible to wind drift and capable of retaining more energy at a greater distance.
2. The smaller caliber (.22) will require more air and/or a longer barrel to get it to the same speed (less area on which to push).
3. The smaller caliber (.22) will penetrate deeper and is more likely to result in a pass-through on game or pests. Conversely, the larger caliber (.25) will produce a larger wound channel and will dissipate a larger portion of its energy, and is less likely to pass through.
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No more like the .22 JSB KOs 25,6gr vs the hybrid .25 26gr
If the bc is both around 0.090 and both speeds are lets say 960fps
roughly it should be somewhere the same right?
If the bc is both around 0.090 and both speeds are lets say 960fps
roughly it should be somewhere the same right?
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In that case, #1 is a wash.
The differences described in numbers 2 and 3 are still relevant.
The differences described in numbers 2 and 3 are still relevant.
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My understanding is the .22 will be better in ballistic due to higher sectional density, however given the same dome head on the pellets the .25 will have a much bigger impact area and therefore less penetration which usually is better for small games with better energy dump. With larger games then more penetration could be better, so it's the good old answer of .......it all depends. Right tool for the right job is a better way to look at it, what job are you trying to setup for? paper punching? Small game hunting in close range/backyard? Small game in long range? Larger game in close quarters...........
I've been toiling with the similar question and my conclusion is I'm sticking with the .25 and turn down power to get less penetration for smaller games and turn up the power for larger games. After experimenting a bit I found the 25 to be slightly more versatility due to the fact I can really crank it up for the bigger games. However with the right gun and slugs .22 can be extremely potent also. If your gun doesn't have the range of adjustability then get both .22 and .25, we all can agree on the n + 1 theory right?
I've been toiling with the similar question and my conclusion is I'm sticking with the .25 and turn down power to get less penetration for smaller games and turn up the power for larger games. After experimenting a bit I found the 25 to be slightly more versatility due to the fact I can really crank it up for the bigger games. However with the right gun and slugs .22 can be extremely potent also. If your gun doesn't have the range of adjustability then get both .22 and .25, we all can agree on the n + 1 theory right?
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all equal maybe the same. But I went with the .25 just to have the option to shoot heavier slugs/pellets if I wanted to.
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In my experience you can get to a bc with slugs approaching .1 in both calibers In .22 you need to be shooting close to a 30g (quite heavy for caliber) slug.
In .25 you can get around the same bc from a 33.5g (Quite lite for caliber)slug. I‘ve found it much easier to achieve the speeds needed for stability with the .25 cal slugs.
That is lower regulator pressure ect.
So for long range performance I’d say in .25 it’s easier to achieve
In .25 you can get around the same bc from a 33.5g (Quite lite for caliber)slug. I‘ve found it much easier to achieve the speeds needed for stability with the .25 cal slugs.
That is lower regulator pressure ect.
So for long range performance I’d say in .25 it’s easier to achieve
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i try to keep my shots under 100 yds. i go with the 33.95 pellets in .25. cal. no reason for me to use expensive slugs for that. will try the hades this year. .25 is a cheaper way to hit hard. JMO.
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0.25 puts a bigger hole in live game compared to 0.22. If that makes any difference with everything else being equal... If never hunting and only paper punching then I would think the 0.22 at the same weight and ballistic coefficient as compared to the 0.25 would be the better choice for 100 yard and beyond due to less frontal air deflection. I can only imagine a super 0.177 high power heavy hitter entering this playing field... Yo!
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When I ordered my .22/700mm Impact I considered getting a .25 caliber but couldn't justify one for my applications - target; plinking; pesting and small game hunting (in that order).
For me, 99% of the time the (typical) 30 fpe a .22 PCP develops is more than adequate and lower pellet costs (larger selection) and less air consumption are definitely points to consider as I like to shoot a lot.
Per the OP's question, I believe that the performance gap between the .22 and .25 calibers has stayed the same as modern PCPs in both has shown a marked increase in power allowing heavier projectiles and correspondingly higher energy levels.
That being said, my new .22 Impact can be tuned to 60+ fpe (which is more than my stock .25 FX Royale produces) if I chose to go there. My Impact will end up being tuned for 25 grain pellets and slugs for long range (up to 125 yard) shooting as that is what the rifle was purchased for... I am guessing that will be in the 50 fpe range.
I agree that the .25 (and larger) calibers definitely have a place when hunting larger animals (raccoons and bigger) and at extremely long range (that's anything over 125 yards for me) but for pests, squirrels; rabbits and the occasional groundhog the .22 is plenty for the job. Yes, the .25 makes a larger hole and transfers more energy but it doesn't kill any faster or better than a .22 with proper shot placement. Seems that with trend to higher velocities, the new expanding pellets and slugs will increase the capabilities/performance of the .22 caliber.
If groundhogs hunting or ground squirrels at long range were my thing then I would chose a .25 or .30; for my applications (tree squirrels and rabbits at mostly sub 50 yard ranges) a .22 covers the bases very nicely.
Just my two cents.
For me, 99% of the time the (typical) 30 fpe a .22 PCP develops is more than adequate and lower pellet costs (larger selection) and less air consumption are definitely points to consider as I like to shoot a lot.
Per the OP's question, I believe that the performance gap between the .22 and .25 calibers has stayed the same as modern PCPs in both has shown a marked increase in power allowing heavier projectiles and correspondingly higher energy levels.
That being said, my new .22 Impact can be tuned to 60+ fpe (which is more than my stock .25 FX Royale produces) if I chose to go there. My Impact will end up being tuned for 25 grain pellets and slugs for long range (up to 125 yard) shooting as that is what the rifle was purchased for... I am guessing that will be in the 50 fpe range.
I agree that the .25 (and larger) calibers definitely have a place when hunting larger animals (raccoons and bigger) and at extremely long range (that's anything over 125 yards for me) but for pests, squirrels; rabbits and the occasional groundhog the .22 is plenty for the job. Yes, the .25 makes a larger hole and transfers more energy but it doesn't kill any faster or better than a .22 with proper shot placement. Seems that with trend to higher velocities, the new expanding pellets and slugs will increase the capabilities/performance of the .22 caliber.
If groundhogs hunting or ground squirrels at long range were my thing then I would chose a .25 or .30; for my applications (tree squirrels and rabbits at mostly sub 50 yard ranges) a .22 covers the bases very nicely.
Just my two cents.
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Vana2 - Your first paragraph was the most important: "my applications – target; plinking; pesting and small game hunting (in that order)"
We all want the universal gun that does it all perfectly, but that gun doesn't exist, so this whole crazy sport is really just many compromises that we hope performs well.
I have a .22 Marauder and a .25 Impact. Next gun (Probably another Impact) will probably be a .22 because of economy over a .30 or other larger caliber. I mostly punch holes in paper and a .22 does that quite well unless wind is involved, then the larger calibers seem to work better. .22 is a third cheaper on ammunition costs, uses less air, quieter, etc. These are important factors for me.
Other advantage to a .22 is that more people shoot it. It's more common so new improvements often come out in .22 before other calibers.
I punch paper, I plink, very little pesting and hunting, so for me, a .22 is a better choice. I hope it works out that way for you as well.
We all want the universal gun that does it all perfectly, but that gun doesn't exist, so this whole crazy sport is really just many compromises that we hope performs well.
I have a .22 Marauder and a .25 Impact. Next gun (Probably another Impact) will probably be a .22 because of economy over a .30 or other larger caliber. I mostly punch holes in paper and a .22 does that quite well unless wind is involved, then the larger calibers seem to work better. .22 is a third cheaper on ammunition costs, uses less air, quieter, etc. These are important factors for me.
Other advantage to a .22 is that more people shoot it. It's more common so new improvements often come out in .22 before other calibers.
I punch paper, I plink, very little pesting and hunting, so for me, a .22 is a better choice. I hope it works out that way for you as well.
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I am personally wrestling with this decision on a new purchase and would like some clarification about to what degree a couple points made in this thread. I am most concerned with accuracy with slugs for hunting small game between 75 yards to 125 yards with a crosswind. Does a .25 cal resist a crosswind better because it is heavier, or a .22 because it has a lower profile and higher speed. Also, as far as air usage can anyone give an estimate with a shot count shooting .22 and .25 with the same grain weight at the same fps? Also some mention the .25 is louder. What is the source of this loudness? Is it the sound of the impact or something to do with the projectile speeds entering the trans sonic zone between lets say 950 fps to speeds to 1100 fps at the muzzle? Inquiring minds want to know.
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I can't give you advice on slugs as I don't use them, but as already stated above, with the same weight and muzzle energy, the smaller caliber will have a better BC. For hunting though, I'd probably still get the .25. The difference will be there, but might not really matter for practical hunting distances. It will matter more if you're a champion caliber target shooter and you're trying to squeeze every bit of performance as you can... at which point, why not start looking at even heavier and maybe even larger calibers. You don't have to shoot the same weight .25 and .22. If those are the two calibers in question, you can always shoot a heavier .25 and then the question about differences in BC starts to even out.
I can say though that power for power, a larger caliber is much more efficient. My two examples are the Taipan Veteran Standards in .22 and .25 calibers. For how I had them tuned, both were getting about 50 shots on the reg. However, the .22 was only producing 31 FPE at 95 bars reg pressure and the .25 was 44 FPE at 100 bars reg pressure. Same gun, just different calibers.
For a similar power comparison, I had the .22 Veteran Standard tuned to 27 FPE at 90 bars reg pressure and the Veteran Short .25 at 25 FPE with 65 bars reg pressure. They're not the same FPE but the Veteran Short's barrel is more than 4 inches shorter than the Standard. Even with such a barrel disadvantage, the .25 Short still gets about 80 shots on the reg while the .22 Standard only gets 60. The Short is also much more quiet than the Standard with these tunes. Again, not exactly the same gun but it should at least give you an idea how efficient the bigger caliber is.
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Thanks for the well thought detailed response it helps a lot as I had some wrong understandings. Why does the 25 use air more efficiently power for power? I find myself hunting taking shots hunting typically between 40 yards to 100 yards. I would probably take more shots at 100+ but since I only have 27fpe in .22 at the muzzle the drop off in energy at those distances starts to get questionably ethical. However, I am looking to step up to a new air rifle shooting 50 fpe at the muzzle so with a heavier pellet or slug I could carry good power at that longer distance. My intuitive sense says that shooting a heavy 22 slug would give me a better BC and accuracy at that distance. Just to make sure I am understanding you, are you saying the .25 is better for power and accuracy at that distance and more efficient using air translating to a higher shot count per fill as well as more power and accuracy at 90 -125 yards?
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The reason why the .25 is more efficient is because there's more area for the air to push against. I read many times people always say that a .25 will use more air and be louder than a .22. in my experience though, that is not always the case. Assuming the guns are tuned properly, it really comes down to the guns' designs and setup.
With my Taipans, I was hesitant to get the .25 because people always say shot count will be lower and it will also be louder. I shot the .22 for 4 year until I couldn't bare it anymore and bought the .25. the .25 tuned to 44 FPE gets the same shot count and not anymore louder than the .22 tuned to 30 FPE I have. Same guns, just different caliber.
Of course, this will not be true for all guns. As I said above, it largely depends on how the gun was designed.
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