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Airgun Projectile BC for Complete Dummies

In this case I'm the dummy. This evening I tried using the ballistic feature in my Pard NV008 LRF. It was asking for data that I didn't have. To obtain the scope height I took calipers and measure from the middle of the breech to around the middle of the objective lens. Then I chronographed a shot string to get an average fps. Then I noticed that the scope asked for a "far distance" velocity. I have no way of knowing that without setting my chronograph downrange close to the target. No way am I doing that. I already shot the chrony in a shooting session this year. I'm not doing it. So what are my other options besides a Garmin, FX, or LabRadar type of chronograpgh? I'm trying to calculate the BC of the pellets I'm shooting hoping that I can eventually be lazy and not have to remember my holdovers for night shooting once I get this scope dialed in. This "far distance" term is throwing me off. What does that even mean? How far away from the rifle does the measured "far distance" have to be? Anyone else with beginner questions on ballistic coefficient fire away.

Huben  New Huben K1 acquisition

Finally Got my new 2024 K1 and have only shot about 100 rounds so far. Kelly from Krazykool has been helping me with reg setting and fps.
He also set me up with the appropriate slugs. It’s not broken in yet but so far at 50yrds it pretty accurate. I’m going to try a few different moderators and no moderator and try and tighten it up but so far it’s doing 5 shots @ 50 yards jsb mkll 25/34 results are from 1” - 1 1/4” with 1 second between shots. It’s not a tack driver but I am sure after proper break in a tuning tweaks I can get it to approximately 1” @ 100 yards. I don’t have expectations of it being as accurate as my fx maverick in sniper setup but I do consider the fact that it is a semi. So far it’s an awesome platform. By the way I also own the GK1 in 25cal and it does 1-1 1/4” @ 50 yards with jsb mkll, tripod and bug buster scope no problem. Absolutely amazing guns.
Will follow up with progress reports and then later slug results.

Air Venturi  Contender for the BEST BUDGET PCP AIR RIFLE

My buddy went to an auction and picked up three pcp airguns. A Streamline in .25, a Cometa Lynx in .177 and an Avenger .22. After shooting the absolutely awesome Streamline, we moved to the Avenger. The rifle had some sort of coffee can size 3D printed moderator made in Taiwan, which looked funny but worked just fine, and the trigger was horrid. Soooo, I took it apart and removed all the screws and springs in the trigger, which are not needed, and added some adjustment screws. After the trigger work, it turned out far better than expected at around 8 oz and crisp as you could image. So, now it was time to do some shooting. I started at 25 yards and couldn't see where it was hitting on the paper, until I noticed a hole just inside the edge of the black bullseye. When I walked out to check it out, I found, I had just put about seven shots in a single hole! Holy cow!, I wasn't even trying that hard, I was just trying to sight it in. So, on out to 30 meters, and sure enough, one hole groups. Different ammo produced almost the same results. I was astonished. We get the chrony out and 8.44gr JSB clocked in at 946 fps avg. I turned the hammer spring down just a tad, moved to 50 yards and dime sized groups at 900 fps with the same JSB pellets. This thing is an incredible shooter for sure. I had no idea the Avenger was so good of a gun. It seems this thing shoots good no matter what you adjust on it. I even tried Crosman CPHP pellets and they grouped in one ragged hole at 30M.

The Avenger is pretty well balanced, right weight and well made.

For ~$350, how in the world could you ever beat this rifle for performance? I thought the Notos was the best value in airguns today, but this beats it handily.

Traditional Pistol  SOLD Fantastic Diana 6M For Sale…SOLD Pending Funds

Extremely nice, sweet shooting Diana 6M with recoilless (GISS) system with fantastic walnut (R) grips and two extra piston seals.
Rear sight has a choice of four sights and the front sight is adjustable for blade thickness.
Shooting 7.0 grain RWS wadcutters at 477fps.
Shipped in factory box..

$275.00 delivered
Payment via USPS Money Order

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I got scammed by GraphicMan Innovations on his "Pocket Press"

DO NOT DO BUSINESS WITH GRAPHICMAN INNOVATIONS.
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This press release from GrapicMan arrived recently. His most recent creation known as "The Pocket Press."
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When I opened the packet and saw what was inside, I was really let down. It appears to be a toy.
He himself stated as much. "It appears to be a toy, correct?" Initially, I ordered a set of dies. Subsequently, he persuaded me to switch to the Pocket Press sequence.

When he told me that, I just became very happy. He informed me that he is frightened of others copying his design, thus he doesn't want to display any images or videos of it. He asked for my faith. As a result, I foolishly accepted his comments without understanding how his press appeared. He then requested that I send him the remaining sum that I had paid him via bankwire for the set of dies with Paypal.

Why, initially, didn't he want to take Paypal in the first place? That's the query that's been on my mind. Periodically, a tiny packet would arrive at my door.
To get the delivery, I went outdoors thrilling as you open the envelope. It has a weight of 1.65 lbs. My draw decreased the moment I opened the package. I paid him $915 in all, including the $85 delivery charge for this small package. What a piece of crap this so-called "Pocket Press" is!

A few thin pieces of metal and inexpensive screws hold it together. It's really fragile and thin.

He places a circular ball of wood on top of the handle. Furthermore, it held the punch's top in place with a little nuts. For mounting, he welded a thin metal plate onto it.
His welding skills are not so good. It is impossible to mount it since the four little holes are so far away and by the corner. In order to make it stay stationary, I had to add some washers and lock nuts. The tiny nuts on the side continue to come loose after a few uses.
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When I informed him about it, he suggested adding some super glue. What a farce this guy is!
He continued to tell me that his press is excellent and quite heavy duty! What are your thoughts about it? I feel as though I was just defrauded out of $915 for this subpar Press!
He even informed me that the 1.5 version of the pocket press, which is more durable and less in weight, had just released.
I'll let you evaluate about This Pocket Press.
Making my own slug was enjoyable for me. I feel so sad every time I use and look at this pocket press.

I'm his victim; stay away from him at any cost. I would hate for anyone else to experience this.
About his New Pocket Press, he posted this.
Additionally, he showed me a video before sending my Pocket Press.
He doesn't want to show off his press in the video in an attempt to con me into purchasing it.
He requested that I should not show anyone any images or videos of his Pocket Press.


MORE clearer PICTURES and Video.



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PCP Rifle  WTS New Challenger Pro LB .30 (Gen 2) ...Super Accurate $849

This is a brand new Gen 2 Challenger Pro LB in .30 caliber that was only shot from the bench to film a review video, then put back in the box. 100% as new condition. Please email me for the link to the video if you have not seen it.

Retail: $995.00

Price: $849 with free shipping. Ships the same day, well packed and double boxed. Thanks -Nate @ Airgun Channel

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  • Question
FX  I haven’t shot my FX Impact M3 in 6 months. Is there anything I should do to the gun before I start shooting again?

The gun has been stored in a case in a cool, dry closet. It has been stored with tank pressure is 210 bar.
The 1st reg was set to 200 bar and the gauge reads 200bar.
The 2nd reg was set to 150 bar and the gauge reads 155 bar, so it has crept 5 bar during the 6 months of storage.

Bipods/Rests  NLA Two Vets Recon v2 Tripod w/ Area419 ball head and ARCALOCK QD

Excellent condition, very light / minimal use (hence for sale). Very solid tripod that might just classify as indestructible, 55mm ball head is very smooth and locks down reliably even with a ton of weight behind it. Extends very high and drops down low to BR height

Terms: $675 shipped CONUS (Zelle) or PP with fees. Not interested in trades.

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PCP Rifle  SOLD .72 Zeus Carbine and great Kami *SPF*

I have a very lightly used AEA Zeus .72 carbine with a Donny FL Great Kami, a black arts Tactical barrel clamp and some 410 grain Mr hollow points. I can no longer hold big long air rifles, nor can I take much recoil either. I would like to trade for a small light bullpup, either an Avenge X in .177 or a Stoeger XM1 bullshark in .177. Thanks for looking. If you would like to buy it outright, I would ask $650 shipped.

Full disclosure, it leaks air through the barrel, it is a ver slow leak, but I have contacted the pellet shop and they told me that it is not unusual for the that.
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Fox den or folklore?

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Alfie, my over-enthusiastic Labrador, had been under house arrest for a week, recovering from a minor cyst removal that, in his mind, might as well have been major surgery. To him, it was akin to being imprisoned, and he had the dramatic sighs to prove it. So, naturally, the moment I strutted downstairs in my hunting gear—looking the part, mind you—he completely lost his marbles. Tail wagging like a windscreen wiper on full speed, paws dancing about as if he was auditioning for Strictly Come Dancing.

I couldn’t help but feel a pang of guilt watching him go through what I can only describe as an emotional meltdown. Eyes wide, tongue lolling, practically pleading, “You’re not leaving me behind again, mate, are you?” I gave in, of course. Call me soft, but when a dog looks at you like that, it’s game over. He was coming along.

And just like that, my quiet, peaceful hunting expedition had transformed into an outing with a hyperactive furball who hadn't seen the outside world in seven whole days—dog years, that’s nearly a month! What could possibly go wrong?

As we pulled up to the permission, Alfie was bouncing around in the back of the Jeep like a toddler who’d just mainlined a double espresso. He was making it abundantly clear that his excitement levels were somewhere between "won the lottery" and "discovered where I hide the treats." I half-expected him to burst through the back window, paws first.

I tried to rein him in, giving his slip lead a little tug as we hopped out. Easy, lad, I muttered, though it was more a suggestion than a command. His enthusiasm was infectious, but I had to keep him on a tight leash—both figuratively and literally—or the only thing I’d be hunting today was a runaway Lab.

The weather had decided to play nice for once. According to my smartwatch, it was a rather delightful 22°C. The sun was out, birds were singing, and it was shaping up to be a cracking day. In fact, the whole scene was so idyllic, I half expected David Attenborough to pop out from behind a hedge and start narrating.

My shooting location today was an old marl-pit, excavated in the 18th century for building material. The charm of a marl pit lies in its clay base, which almost always holds a bit of water, making it a wildlife magnet. As we approached the pit’s edge, Alfie’s lead, which had been stretched taut by his eagerness, suddenly went slack. He stopped dead, about 20 metres from the pit, like someone had hit his ‘pause’ button. No more bouncing or wriggling—he was frozen, staring straight ahead as if he'd just seen the ghost of Christmas Past. I stood there, half expecting him to point out some quarry, maybe a rabbit or a woodpigeon. But there was nothing. Nada. Just an eerie silence and Alfie, who, instead of charging forward, now looked like he was sizing up the idea of retreating altogether. Which, coming from a dog who normally lives for the hunt, was more than a bit strange.

A woodpigeon suddenly exploded out of some ivy like it had been fired from a cannon, startling us both. But instead of getting excited, Alfie, in a rare display of cowardice, attempted to bolt in the opposite direction, nearly strangling himself on the lead in his haste to flee.

I quickly sat him down, knelt beside him, and gave him a soothing pat. What’s up with you, lad? I muttered, genuinely confused. Normally, he’d be all over something like this—head first into the brush without a second thought—but today he was acting like I’d dragged him into a haunted forest.
After a moment of attempted reassurance, I decided to get on with it. I loaded a pellet into my Weihrauch HW97K and gave Alfie the “heel” command as I began to descend into the hollow. Only, halfway down, I realised Alfie hadn’t moved an inch. He was still rooted to the spot at the top of the slope, looking at me like I’d just suggested we go for a swim in shark-infested waters. C’mon, boy! I whispered, a hint of impatience creeping in.

But no, he stood firm, as if my commands had become entirely optional today. Clearly, something was spooking him, but what? A woodpigeon couldn’t be the cause, surely… could it?

Down at the bottom, I moved carefully. What I thought was a rabbit shot into the thicket, vanishing before I could get a bead on it. I glanced up at Alfie, who was staring right back, having caught sight of it too. Only, he had all the enthusiasm of a garden gnome.

I've bagged a few dozen rabbits here over the years, though never fancied eating them—too meagre and with fur that's about as appealing as an old ragged mop. In past escapades, I've startled roe deer, muntjac, hares, and even the odd fox from this very refuge.

Then something caught my eye—something off. Standing tall and solid, was a large oak tree. Now, I’d been to this patch of land plenty before, and I could swear, I’d never seen that tree before. It felt out of place, like someone had plonked it there overnight for a bit of woodland theatre. Not that the tree itself was particularly creepy, but there was something about its presence that felt unnatural, like it didn’t quite belong here.

At the base of the trunk, there was a gaping hollow, large enough to fit a large dog—or, if I was daft enough to try, me. The bark around the opening was smooth and worn, like it had been there for centuries, with creatures of all sorts passing through over the years.

Curiosity got the better of me. Ignoring Alfie’s rather pointed look that clearly said, Leave it, mate, I wandered over to investigate. What on earth had been using this as a den? And how had I never noticed it before?

As I stepped closer, the dog started whining, his nerves getting the better of him. Shh, Alfie, it’s just a tree, I whispered, though even I wasn’t entirely convinced. This must be a fox den, surely. The earth around the base was disturbed, with fresh prints scattered about, clearly indicating that its occupant had been in and out recently.

Judging by the size of the den, I suspected it was a hefty fox, perhaps one that fancied itself a bit of a local lord in this neck of the woods. Yet, as I leaned in closer, I was slightly puzzled by the absence of that distinctive musky fox smell. Surely, if Alfie had caught a whiff, he’d have been down there like a shot.

He kept watching me from the pit’s edge, his eyes wide and shimmering with a nervous glint. Something was definitely off.

As I turned away from the tree and its unsettling hollow, I couldn’t shake the feeling of unease creeping up my spine. It struck me how eerily quiet the area had become. The birds that usually filled the pit with their cheerful chatter were conspicuously absent, leaving the air heavy with a strange stillness that felt more oppressive than tranquil.
A quick glance at my watch revealed the temperature had dropped sharply to 14°C. Odd, considering we were barely a few feet below the surface of the field. Something about this whole scene didn’t sit right with me, and I could almost hear the caution bells ringing in my head.

I pushed through the undergrowth toward the black pond, which, in summer, was infamous for breeding swarms of midges that could make a grown man weep. Yet today, the scene was entirely different. There were no tracks, no prints—nothing. It was as if the whole place had been put on lockdown. As I gazed into the water's dark mirror, I saw the reflection of a pair of crows passing overhead, quickly veering away as they spotted me.

As I continued to shuffle about below, I caught glimpses of woodpigeons fluttering in and out of the trees on the pit's edge. With my sights set on bagging at least one, I figured it was time to get serious.

I made my way back up the slope, where Alfie was still firmly rooted to his spot, casting the odd nervous glance at that ominous tree trunk, as if it might spring to life and start chatting with him. Poor lad was on high alert.

The first bunch of pigeons landed just out of sight, tucked away behind the next tree in line. Typical. They always have a knack for making me work for it. With a silent prayer that they would stick around, I settled into a crouch, trying to become one with the undergrowth. I needed to blend in like a chameleon at a paint shop if I wanted any chance of a clean shot. With Alfie’s nervous energy buzzing behind me, it was a miracle I didn’t scare them away myself.

Finally, a pigeon landed just above me, perfectly positioned like it had been dropped there by the hunting gods themselves. I ranged it carefully, adjusting for the steep angle, and squeezed off a shot. The pellet struck clean under the chin, and the bird spiraled into the ivy.

I waited for the thud, but it never came. Must’ve wedged itself in the branches somewhere. I looked back at Alfie—head on paws, eyes wide, clearly saying: Let’s get out of here, boss!

More birds arrived, but none stayed long, thanks to Alfie’s constant twitching. Every rustle in the undergrowth set him off, his eyes repeatedly flicking to the tree trunk. That was enough for me. The heebie-jeebies had fully set in, and I had no intention of poking around any longer. I couldn’t even bring myself to search for the pigeon I’d shot; we were done!

I clipped Alfie’s lead back on, and he practically dragged me across the field, constantly glancing over his shoulder, as if the tree in the pit might suddenly uproot itself and follow us.

On the drive back home, I thought about how I’d spin this tale for my mates. Maybe I’d tell them I’d stumbled across some mythical beast’s lair—far more thrilling than admitting Alfie had been spooked by an unseen fox. That said, even I wasn’t entirely convinced I hadn’t just had a run-in with something a bit more sinister...

Airgun Technologies  Vulcan 3 HP .30 with added Huma MOD40-4/0 = severe clipping!

I recently got a Vulcan 3 HP .30 and had severe problems with slug clipping when i attached a brand new Huma MOD40-4/0.

Since the moderator is modular, i was able to try different configurations, from several meters in POI shift all baffles to a less than 10cm shift of POI on 50m with two baffles.
At last i was at only one segment of the moderator, but i want to test it more before i can say if that has no effect on POI. (Even with just one segment, it still muffles the report a bit.)

I am writing this here, since others might be interested in this set-up as well. i also wrote Huma about it and they confirmed my understanding that this is caused by the
a) small bore in their moderators (1,5 mm + caliber) for best effect
and
b) the fact, that the gun has a shroud with build in moderator over the barrel, which means the external moderator is not directly on the barrel end but on the shroud end causing the projectile not to leave the shroud in the centre of the hole.

Huma suggested, to either use a external moderator one caliber bigger or to drill out the baffles until clipping stops. Bummer, i just goth the thing. =(

Umarex  Leaning towards a Zelos as a first PCP

I am in North East Kansas and I have a significant pest problem with squirrels, skunks, rats, raccoons. Sort of feels like I am losing a game of Jumanji.

My Gamo spring gun has become somewhat worn out, and bench testing of favorite projectiles has revealed a problem I don't want to chase. I prefer accuracy over energy, but accuracy without energy is also useless. I'm thinking .25 caliber is likely the sweet spot for me.

I know very little about PCP rifles. I suspect that my OCDness would prefer a regulated rifle. I want something that I can hunt with. As mentioned, accuracy is critical... this must hold minute-of-squirrel at 50 yards. I'm also a little bit of a trigger princess. I'm a competitive shooter in a few disciplines and crunchy triggers gives me the heaves.

So.. with that in mind, I'm also trying to keep this rig for the rifle and scope under $1k. The Umarex Zelos has caught my eye, but I'm noting that some members indicate that they have had some quality issues.

Thoughts?

Also... is there an on-shore distributor that is better to work with? I'd prefer to purchase from a small shop that knows the sport well and provides good service should I get a leaky / loose / whatever issue. Thanks in advance.

Frank

Frustrated with Hidden Shipping Fees. Any Suggestions?

As an infrequent ammo buyer, I’ve recently found it challenging to shop online for the best deals. While searching for low prices, I’ve noticed that shipping costs often push the total far beyond my budget. I’ve used AmmoSeek, but it requires adding items to the cart just to see the final cost with shipping, which has been time-consuming and frustrating.

Can anyone recommend ammo directory that displays the total price, including shipping, upfront? nor Any ammo retailers who offers lowest price with lowest shipping price.

I’m looking for a more efficient way to find the best deals without the hassle of repeatedly checking out.
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Diana  How a stormrider should be

Figured since I couldn't sell this for even 200 shipped, I would cut it down and make it how it should come from the factory.

The allure of the stormrider is that is compact and light. Problem is, it's still 41" with the factory moderator.

I took off 4.5" of barrel and bought a TKO for a crosman since they're 7/16" barrel and the diana has a 12mm barrel. I just bored the TKO out till it slipped snug over the freshly crowned barrel.

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It now sits at 36.5" OAL, and regulated down to 90 psi, it's getting almost 50 mouse fart shots at 10.5 fpe. Still capable of 24 fpe with the shortened barrel, but this will be a low power pester.

Any other stormrider/SPA 900 owners feel free to post up pics here if you'd like!

What do you shoot at

I shoot a lot of targets at 30-40-and 50 yards, Depends on the wind, (west Texas) I also shoot a lot of little dime size caps as pictured, The little red caps come off insulin syringes,
I will also pick up old brass and shoot, Them things zing sometimes, Little plastic Amy men from the dollar store, 100 come in a bag cheap,, Any kind of pill bottle filled with water, sand, cloth, just about anything, Used shot gun shells, shoot them at the very top and I have had them fly 30 feet in the air, I give up shooting marbles to much glass on the ground
anything the wife is about to toss and is hard plastic that I can stick a target on, Trained the wife to ask you want this to shoot, LOL. Old keys hung on a old 2x4 make crazy bends
I can't shoot any candy or cereal on my target range , My horse goes crazy and destroys my shooting range , Tacks are fun but a problem with them on the ground, Any nut , NO NO not you!!! The little texas round pecan that is not worth cracking to eat is a blast , They explode, seem the birds get them before the horse ,
My 50 yard backstop is railroad ties its the best, 40 yards is thin metal 3x4 with rubber mat and cardboard clipped on for paper targets to stick to, I replace cardboard often ,
30 yards are three big 4 foot x 2 food homemade bird, squirrel , and varmint feeders , With 50 LBS of grain put out 24/7 to feed my pet squirrels song birds and the pest that I shoot.
I could post pictures of all this crap,. oops I mean good stuff , If you really want to see it,, I should have titled this 20 years of air gun shooting , Its more like 48 years but 20 years hard core in the sport and all that stuff,,,,LOL
Mike
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Traditional Rifle  SOLD FWB 601 .177 SSP Target Rifle

Feinwerkbau FWB 601 .177 Single Stroke Pneumatic Target rifle Very nice condition & works great. Likes 7.33 JSB or AA Falcons at about 560fp sand also 7.0 R10s are shooting at about 575fps. The FWB 603 rear sight that is pictures is included. I had the rifle resealed in 2019. $895 shipped to where legal in the lower 48 states US. Preferred payment types are USPS Money Order, bank MO or PayPal F&F.. I would also accept regular paypal + 4%. No trades.

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Calculating Ballistic Coefficient

I was just working out formulas to calculate BC, one using the Chairgun method, the other using the Pyramyd air method (this sites calculator uses this method as well). Are any of you familiar with either? If not here is a quick peak:

PyramydAir (and the calculator here) uses a very simplified formula from Steve_NC IIRC:
bc = -(100000*(Distance)/(8000*LN(FarVelocity/NearVelocity))/100000

While Chairgun uses:
bc = (AirDensity* Distance) / ( SQRT(FarVelocity) - SQRT(NearVelocity))

Both give similar yet quite different results.

At 50 yards distance between measured velocities, 876 near and 762 far fps, the first formula gives a bc of .0448, while the second formula gives a bc of .0407 using my air density data through Chairgun. Even with more standardized air density, Chairgun calculates .049 bc with the above given data.

Anyone with thoughts or input?

I'd suspect the second formula is more appropriate but maybe someone here knows something I do not.






Oh, and what my air density method formula looks like in excel if you want a headache, (or to integrate it into your own spreadsheet) For GA bc

Temp in F, altitude in Ft, Humidity as RH %, Velocity in FPS.

=round((ROUND((((((101325 * EXP(-9.80665 * 0.0289644 * (Altitude*0.3048)/(8.31432 * ((Temp- 32) * 5/9 + 273.15)))-Humidity/100*6.112*EXP((17.67*(Temp- 32) * 5/9 + 273.15-273.15)/((Temp - 32) * 5/9 + 273.15-273.15+243.5))*100)/(287.05*((Temp- 32) * 5/9 + 273.15))+(Humidity/100*6.112*EXP((17.67*(Temp- 32) * 5/9 + 273.15-273.15)/((Temp- 32) * 5/9 + 273.15-273.15+243.5))*100/(461.5*((Temp - 32) * 5/9 + 273.15))))+(Humidity/100*6.112*EXP((17.67*(Temp - 32) * 5/9 + 273.15-273.15)/((Temp- 32) * 5/9 + 273.15-273.15+243.5))*100/(461.5*((Temp - 32) * 5/9 + 273.15))))*0.062428)*0.026068* DistanceYards) / ( SQRT(Near Velocity) - SQRT(Far Velocity)),5)),4)


-Matt

Attached is the above BC calculation which includes air density: Also works with a few other drag laws.

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Attachments

  • BC Calculator.xlsx
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Air Arms  Getting real and practical

My last couple of times out after pest squirrels, I missed just too many easy targets, so I set up a target to see what was going on-was it the gun, the wind, or me? At both 25 and 50 yards my POI was markedly to the left. There was a decent breeze, so I switched direction and shot 180° in the opposite direction…still shot to the left. I decided to shoot in a more controlled setting-a real shooting range, to get a definitive understanding of what was going on. I expected mild winds, but once again it was breezy. Upshot, when it’s windy, for me at least, I’m gonna keep it under forty yards. I had too many misses and too many wounded furballs make it back to their burrows. BTW-the gun is an older 22cal pre-safety AA s410 with a Meopta scope.

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